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Post by woolybanana on Aug 10, 2022 12:09:39 GMT 1
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Post by ForumUser2 on Aug 10, 2022 14:33:02 GMT 1
I'm curious, without management who will do the following:
Monitor and order supplies Recruit staff Pay staff Administer leave Control dangerous chemicals, pharmaceuticals etc. Monitor and allocate beds. Administer the IT systems. Administer works services in wards, theatres etc. Validate clinical qualifications Liaise with other trusts, health areas, clinics providing NHS treatment to provide services. Administer finances including paying suppliers, new equipment, building works, renovations and all the rest.
Perhaps the uninformed would like clinical staff to do that? If not you have to have administrators - from the payroll clerk through to the Chief Exec.
Previous governments have tried to foist admin duties onto dept heads. They were politely told to F*** Off.
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tim17
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Post by tim17 on Aug 10, 2022 14:51:01 GMT 1
Some context -
Managers make up 3% of the NHS workforce.
In the UK economy as a whole management accounts for 9%.
The NHS has big problems but being management 'top heavy' isn't a major one.
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Nifty
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Post by Nifty on Aug 10, 2022 14:58:37 GMT 1
Re post Aug 9 2022 at 8:30pm hvm likes this Let us be crystal clear. Nifty did not say. I saw that. That was what I liked. Also I liked your response because you mentioned me and blanked the authors. Because that was fair. 🤣🤣🤣 I don’t recall doing any such thing.
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Nifty
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Post by Nifty on Aug 10, 2022 15:04:15 GMT 1
I'm curious, without management who will do the following: Monitor and order supplies Recruit staff Pay staff Administer leave Control dangerous chemicals, pharmaceuticals etc. Monitor and allocate beds. Administer the IT systems. Administer works services in wards, theatres etc. Validate clinical qualifications Liaise with other trusts, health areas, clinics providing NHS treatment to provide services. Administer finances including paying suppliers, new equipment, building works, renovations and all the rest. Perhaps the uninformed would like clinical staff to do that? If not you have to have administrators - from the payroll clerk through to the Chief Exec. Previous governments have tried to foist admin duties onto dept heads. They were politely told to F*** Off. HAL could sort it without resorting to asterisks.
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Post by ForumUser2 on Aug 10, 2022 15:11:08 GMT 1
Some context - Managers make up 3% of the NHS workforce. In the UK economy as a whole management accounts for 9%. The NHS has big problems but being management 'top heavy' isn't a major one. Oh bloody hell. Stop it will you? How are the ignorant to nurse their prejudices if you keep presenting facts?
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Post by lindalovely on Aug 10, 2022 15:13:56 GMT 1
All of the French healthcare system is essentially Private..in that it contracts back to the State sector. GPs are for the most part Profession Liberale..As are community nurses etc. The only question is who reimburses the charges. If they are reimbursed by the state and the mutuelle insurances there is an agreed set of fees that the professional and cliniques are allowed to charge. All is pretty tightly controlled by the government and the mutuelles. You can't jump the queue or get quicker treatment for 'going private' and in many areas the services work together. For example, in Bergerac all acute surgery is going to be moved to the main hospital, out of the private clinique..and some services will be carried out only at the clinique.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2022 10:17:35 GMT 1
Not just the NHS. France has the same problems. But they have cliniques to take up the slack. These are private but State overseen UK does the same. My sister-in-law had a double hip transplant done at BUPA but funded by the NHS.
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Post by pcpa on Aug 11, 2022 10:29:31 GMT 1
The specialist hip replacement clinique at Abbeville used to do hundreds of NHS operations every year, it was a major part of their turnover and was the major hook in the proposal and business plan for the funding of the building and the project.
Several bi-lingual UK immigrants were running successfull businesses doing meet & greet, prise en charge, translation, and accompaniment including the post op return journey, I guess that will have all come to an end now.
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Nifty
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Post by Nifty on Aug 11, 2022 10:58:29 GMT 1
Not just the NHS. France has the same problems. But they have cliniques to take up the slack. These are private but State overseen UK does the same. My sister-in-law had a double hip transplant done at BUPA but funded by the NHS. How will this pan-out in the UK and France I wonder. It seems to me that somebody is going to be crying in the not too distant future. Probably those furthest from the top of the pile.
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Post by woolybanana on Aug 11, 2022 11:09:45 GMT 1
Health care needs a mixed public private response; if hips and knees can be better fixed in a specialist unit in France, paid at an agreed rate by the NHS with an agreed protocol which includes pre and post op. treatment then why the he// not do that and, for once, put the PATIENT first.
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Nifty
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Post by Nifty on Aug 11, 2022 11:19:22 GMT 1
I do not know how much average waiting times for op’s comes Into the equation, but, from what I understand they are very much shorter in France than the UK.
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Post by ForumUser2 on Aug 11, 2022 12:04:46 GMT 1
Health care needs a mixed public private response; if hips and knees can be better fixed in a specialist unit in France, paid at an agreed rate by the NHS with an agreed protocol which includes pre and post op. treatment then why the he// not do that and, for once, put the PATIENT first. It's actually quite common for certain operative procedures to be sent outwith the NHS to a specialist private hospital at a set fee per procedure. However, while the media tend to concentrate on operative procedures, the bulk of time and therefore money is spent on non-invasive medicine. In fact I'd go as far as to say that a very significant loss of service is tending to malingerers and the worried well. Which is another way of saying that people don't value what they don't pay for and abuse the system. Not everyone, but enough to drain not just resources but the enthusiasm of practitioners!
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Post by woolybanana on Aug 11, 2022 12:57:45 GMT 1
Fair comment.
What about bed blocking by local authorities? Do they pay fees?
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Post by Seaboots on Aug 11, 2022 13:09:52 GMT 1
Health care needs a mixed public private response; if hips and knees can be better fixed in a specialist unit in France, paid at an agreed rate by the NHS with an agreed protocol which includes pre and post op. treatment then why the he// not do that and, for once, put the PATIENT first. That’s actually been happening since the 90s. UK patients have been coming via Limoges airport (and many others) for ages, all being paid for by the NHS. This was brought in the ease the UK waiting lists. I have no idea if it still goes on post Brexit.
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