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Post by hal on Jul 18, 2022 15:50:47 GMT 1
Has anyone - Curtis, you spring to mind - tried or has actually brought a 'classic' car into France that should have a certificate of conformity, but did not have it, or it could not be found? If so, what hoops did you jump through and did you get it in? And if you had to go through the DREAL procedure, how was it?
There is a car I want and can have, built by Vegantune under the name Evante, one of nine that was constructed in 1989, but due to a lengthy administration, never registered until 1999. Certificates were mandatory since 1983, and one must exist for this model as there are one or two others sold into Europe as new, but all the records are now scattered far and wide. I could have one 'made' for the occasion, but wish to exhaust the legal paths first!
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Post by landmannnn on Jul 18, 2022 17:25:47 GMT 1
Nice car
Have you tried the current owner of Evante Cars ltd?
Got to be easier than going through the very expensive DREAL inspection.
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Post by hal on Jul 18, 2022 17:50:55 GMT 1
Evante went bust in 1997 with bits and bobs picked up by people along the way. Spydercars now own the moulds and rights to the name, but with scrappy records. Delving through floppy discs for a CoC is not a priority!
There was an owners club under Robertson's daughter, but all links are now dead.
As you note, a nice little car, but despite the rarity, it is only a modernised Lotus Elan absolutely no value and so it would be a long time before I could economically justify a DREAL inspection.
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curtis
Member
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Posts: 474
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Post by curtis on Jul 18, 2022 19:36:40 GMT 1
Nothing up to date that I can add. The last car I bought from outside France was a MKI Escort Twincam. This came from Spain and was delivered new in Portugal. I wanted the car to be on CGN (I keep clear of CGC). There was no paperwork available as they were never imported into France. I contacted a chap who said he had done it with paperwork from the MKI Escort and the Lotus Cortina combined. When I asked for copies of how he did it there was no more contact. So reluctantly it went on to a CGC. Sorry, ça n'avance pas Le Schmilblic, but it was a little diversion.
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Post by hal on Jul 18, 2022 21:29:03 GMT 1
Two interesting points: I never knew the Escort Twincam was never sold into France! I thought there would be a big take up for it..and why do you keep away from a cgc registration? I thought it is easier this way for older cars?
I think I will forget the Evante and maybe consider building an Escort TC - there are many good Escorts around and I have a spare twin cam soon. I think the TC only had its dash changed inside so not sure if these are around though…
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curtis
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Post by curtis on Jul 18, 2022 22:39:00 GMT 1
It is not as straight forward as a dash change; There are a lot of small but important differances. I had one of the first 1968 TCs with the square headlights and when I was in France I bought one of the last made which very unusually was red. It was a specified factory option at the end. It was in amazingingly good condition. No accidents no panel replaced, original sills. I competed in it all over europe for 10 years. Marvellous cars. It is now very sadly in a collection in America. I decided to sell after I realized that I couldn't drive consistantly fast at night. A fright on the Rallye de Portugal Historico made my mind up.
I am concerned that one day restrictions will come in for cars on CGC. It's no problem being on CGN.
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Post by hal on Jul 19, 2022 7:58:19 GMT 1
Yes, I was being glib in my thoughts of making a TC replica - many body changes for rear strength and gearbox clearance. But 'would be fun as they were quite a tidy car You may well be right for cars on a collection registration, not a huge issue for me, but yes, if you drive an older car regularly, I can see your point. No, I think maybe forget the Evante as it will be problematical, and for once in my life, finish projects I have on the go (like converting my Elan to LHD which has stalled through laziness this past year...)
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curtis
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Post by curtis on Jul 19, 2022 8:37:52 GMT 1
At the time I first had the TwinCam in France there was still the carnet of tickets to be signed if you went outside of the prescribed limits. Have to say I never bothered to get one signed and was never challenged.
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Post by hal on Jul 19, 2022 9:17:39 GMT 1
Help me understand this - surely the only way to import and register a car pre 1983 is as a voiture collection, no? So how can/could you get a pre 1983 imported car onto a normal CG? If I sell a car on a CGC, does it then revert to a normal CG for the new owner?
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curtis
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Post by curtis on Jul 19, 2022 19:39:28 GMT 1
I am trying to remember what I did some years ago as I had several 50/60s cars still on UK plates. Two were sold to French friends and the third I registered here. It was 1955 and is on a CGN. I can remember going to the local impôts office with a receipt for the purchase!!! And a declaration that I had imported the car a few weeks earlier. Then off to the sous Préfecture. I'm sure I didn't have anything else. Have things changed ? Memory fading. To date it was just at the time the new registrations were coming in.
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Post by hal on Jul 19, 2022 20:48:41 GMT 1
Was this back in the eighties maybe? Before the wretched Certificate of Conformity was introduced, if a car was a 'recognised' type, I think it was exactly as you did. However, the CoC changed everything. Any car sold in France, indeed the EU, had to have a manufacturer's CoC after about 1984. This is when FFVE became involved as a quasi-department to, amongst other things, certify all pre 1984 cars and give them a voiture de collection certificate - in effect the CGC. There is no way to circumvent this. I have brought in a Lotus and an MGB where FFVE have been very punctual. This Evante breaks the mould though - the V5 shows it first registered in 1999 and so it must have a CoC to be recognised. As it is post 1984, FFVE cannot intervene. The car is treated as a kit car and must have a single vehicle inspection by DREAL where it must meet mechanical and emission standards of today and likely to cost in excess of 6k€ There are some who will make an 'authentic' CoC, but the penalties if caught is confiscation of the car and a huge fine
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curtis
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Post by curtis on Jul 19, 2022 22:45:35 GMT 1
No, it wasn't that long ago. I mentioned it was when the registration system changed here which was,what, eight or so years? I have no recollection of getting, or trying to get a CoC.
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Post by hal on Jul 22, 2022 14:01:10 GMT 1
I think you were fortunate Curtis in that the person at your Prefecture overlooked the need for a CoC on his/her checklist! All cars registered and.or re-regustered in the EU have needed a CoC for a long time now. Any pre 1984 car will not have one and you have to apply to FFVE to get them to issue one that can be used to get a CG. Prefectures are no longer able to register an imported car so one has to go through ANTS who are less lax in what paperwork is required. If you do import another specialist car, do insist it has a certificate if first registered after 1984, or if it is pre 1984, check with FFVE that they acknowledge existence of the car, otherwise you are in for a single vehicle inspection
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Aardvark
Non-gamer
Living in soggy 22 and still wondering what's going on.
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Post by Aardvark on Jul 22, 2022 16:25:23 GMT 1
Just wondering. Is it possible to buy an older car (or Any car) and bring it into France on a trailer to keep it here but not try to register it to use on the road? For instance a non-runner in bits that would be a several year project to rebuild it.
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curtis
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Post by curtis on Jul 22, 2022 17:05:52 GMT 1
I don't know what the situation would be at customs when you arrive here. Paperwork no doubt, not sure if you would be waved through.
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