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P&O
Mar 18, 2022 17:45:35 GMT 1
Post by pcpa on Mar 18, 2022 17:45:35 GMT 1
Interesting Elsie.
I have a feeling that the true reasons behind this are yet to be revealed, possibly their real intention was to exit from the market, close the business but not be embroiled in all the political and social brooha and having the boats seized & ransacked by the unions, they saw what happened with Seafrance, anything like that dragging out for years would lose them many more hundreds of millions.
I'm sure the emergence of Irish Ferries on the Dover Calais passenger route at a commercially suicidal time is related, perhaps they were convinced to take over the routes but not the employees.
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P&O
Mar 18, 2022 17:50:36 GMT 1
Post by pcpa on Mar 18, 2022 17:50:36 GMT 1
Or perhaps sweeping the decks for an unencombered sale?
Hoping for a government payout?
Goodyear at Amiens have been in a union dispute for the whole of the 17 years that I have lived here, they wanted to adapt to the evolving market and increase efficiency, they ended up investing millions in a new factory but having to keep the old one open and all the syndicalistes on the payroll doing nothing.
Castex visited yesterday and announced IIRC €155 million of state aid, probably because of the upcoming elections.
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P&O
Mar 18, 2022 18:35:09 GMT 1
Post by elsie on Mar 18, 2022 18:35:09 GMT 1
I've not looked at the companies accounts tinyurl.com/yaevfxjl in any detail but I suspect the fixed costs do not vary that much whether the ships are sailing or not. The main cost they could control is the staff costs (around £130M). I suspect the management has been under pressure to make the business more viable. The 2020 accounts do contain various warnings about the loss (which was £103M) and "The directors have taken account of the severe but plausible downsides and are confident that the Group will have sufficient funds, through funding from its ultimate controlling party, DP World Limited, to meet its liabilities as they fall due for that period." In a letter, the CEO has said "This new crew model will reduce our crewing costs by 50% and enable us to better compete and be more responsive to our customers’ needs." and These changes that we’re talking about today are part of DP World’s wider plan to support P&O Ferries to deliver the best for customers across freight and tourism industries. DP World is helping us invest in our future with new ships that will provide a better service for everyone, totalling £250M. www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/po-chiefs-letter-over-mass-26495822
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P&O
Mar 18, 2022 18:59:42 GMT 1
Post by hal on Mar 18, 2022 18:59:42 GMT 1
According to Joel Hill, ITV tinyurl.com/y9o8z4qlThe unions argue that P&O’s UK crew were easy to fire because their contracts were issued in Jersey as part of P&O’s “offshore employment model”. I’m told P&O has c50 Dutch + French crew, employed on contracts in the Netherlands and France who weren’t dismissed yesterday.The non-European crew weren't dismissed either. I spoke with a buddy of mine in Jersey earlier who said the contract was there. So even if the UK were still in the EU and this happened, the sacked crew would have had no recourse to onshore assistance. Brexit therefore does not come into it. Pity. Does not stop me saying that the RMT are numbheads nevertheless!
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Deleted
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P&O
Mar 18, 2022 21:53:21 GMT 1
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2022 21:53:21 GMT 1
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P&O
Mar 18, 2022 23:55:58 GMT 1
Post by specsavers2 on Mar 18, 2022 23:55:58 GMT 1
Maybe i am totally naive but I will not be using this company in the near future based on the information I am aware of now. Another matter this Tory government needs to stamp on hard. That parent company already appears to have there claws into other businesses and enterprises. Purely my thoughts.
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P&O
Mar 19, 2022 11:32:27 GMT 1
via mobile
pcpa likes this
Post by landmannnn on Mar 19, 2022 11:32:27 GMT 1
Definitely something else going on.
The 800 staff will cost about 20 million a year (an operative is on about 21k pa)
P&O ferries carry 10 million passengers per year so the staff costs are a very small proportion of the operating cost per passenger.
Maybe the labour bill could be cut in half by employing Phillipino staff, that would save 10 million, about the same as the redundancy/pay in lieu of notice.
So at least mid 2023 before the labour bill would start to reduce.
My guess is that the ships/routes would be more saleable with cheap crews and that P&O will be flogging them off soon.
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Deleted
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P&O
Mar 19, 2022 11:35:03 GMT 1
Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2022 11:35:03 GMT 1
Maybe i am totally naive but I will not be using this company in the near future based on the information I am aware of now. Another matter this Tory government needs to stamp on hard. That parent company already appears to have there claws into other businesses and enterprises. Purely my thoughts. Don't be looking to this government to curtail the practice of fire and hire. They already talked down a private members bill designed to do just that. Those Tory MPs coming out now in shock and horror at the P&O situation are, surprise surprise, hypocrites. What will it take to waken people to the damage being done by that bunch of incompetent, corrupt charlatans.
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P&O
Mar 19, 2022 11:45:59 GMT 1
pcpa likes this
Post by hal on Mar 19, 2022 11:45:59 GMT 1
In fairness, now that the detail is emerging, the government are to a certain extent powerless. At present, the labour contract is off shore and mostly outside UK control.
I marvel at the ones being dragged out by Labour and the RMT to do much shouting and blaming the Tories. In fact, those who have been sacked should rally around and attack the RMT for taking their dues under false pretences. The RMT must have known somewhere along the line that the labour contract was offshore, yet went ahead to collect money from the workers knowing that there was nothing they could ever do for them.
The government should definitely look at clawing back furlough money and reviewing contracts with DP around the free-port activities...
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P&O
Mar 19, 2022 11:51:41 GMT 1
Post by pcpa on Mar 19, 2022 11:51:41 GMT 1
I marvel at the ones being dragged out by Labour and the RMT to do much shouting and blaming the Tories. In fact, those who have been sacked should rally around and attack the RMT for taking their dues under false pretences. Yes the guy gobbing off at the female politician did strike me as if he was being defensive beneath all the bluster.
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P&O
Mar 19, 2022 12:17:56 GMT 1
via mobile
Post by landmannnn on Mar 19, 2022 12:17:56 GMT 1
Actually it is likely that because the staff were working in the UK that the UK (not Jersey) employment laws are applicable.
That being the case, then at the very least P&O should be fined for not following the 90 day consultation rules.
Saying that, it would be cheaper to pay the fine than go through protracted consultation.
A bit like a tactical foul in football or rugby!
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garbo
Non-gamer
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P&O
Mar 19, 2022 13:31:39 GMT 1
Post by garbo on Mar 19, 2022 13:31:39 GMT 1
Whilst I accept the manner in which this has been done is appalling I read on Sky news website that the workers have each been offered,two & a half weeks redundancy pay for each year worked plus thirteen weeks in lieu of notice & a further thirteen weeks in lieu of no consultation period. For a worker with 10 years service I calculate that as 51 weeks pay. Whilst it may not be easy to find work quickly if you have a years salary in the bank it does help keep the wolf from the door.
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Deleted
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P&O
Mar 19, 2022 15:25:21 GMT 1
Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2022 15:25:21 GMT 1
Whilst I accept the manner in which this has been done is appalling I read on Sky news website that the workers have each been offered,two & a half weeks redundancy pay for each year worked plus thirteen weeks in lieu of notice & a further thirteen weeks in lieu of no consultation period. For a worker with 10 years service I calculate that as 51 weeks pay. Whilst it may not be easy to find work quickly if you have a years salary in the bank it does help keep the wolf from the door. No amount of redundancy money compensates those who would have eventually fallen heir to these "protected" jobs. 800 hundred jobs have been lost to workers who were lied to when the whole country was told Brexit would protect jobs and give us back control.
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exile
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Massif Central
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P&O
Mar 19, 2022 15:26:52 GMT 1
Post by exile on Mar 19, 2022 15:26:52 GMT 1
Actually it is likely that because the staff were working in the UK that the UK (not Jersey) employment laws are applicable. That being the case, then at the very least P&O should be fined for not following the 90 day consultation rules. Saying that, it would be cheaper to pay the fine than go through protracted consultation. A bit like a tactical foul in football or rugby! But were they working in the UK? As maritime workers those in Liverpool, Hull and Dover will have spent at least half of their working time in another country. The NI ferry route is I grant different
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Nifty
Member
Posts: 5,439
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P&O
Mar 21, 2022 11:47:44 GMT 1
Post by Nifty on Mar 21, 2022 11:47:44 GMT 1
The ‘true reasons’ for BE: there are many contenders,
I think that the puppeteers didn’t want their banking practices put under observation was probably number one.
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