Nifty
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Post by Nifty on Aug 10, 2023 13:45:24 GMT 1
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Aardvark
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Living in soggy 22 and still wondering what's going on.
Posts: 2,172
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Post by Aardvark on Aug 10, 2023 14:17:41 GMT 1
I have a long-unanswered question. Since it appears that the migrants aren't just being given a boat and told to head north, there being a driver who actually does the crossing, why don't the authorities arrest the driver, take him straight to court and destroy the boat so it can't be used for another trip. Alternatively sell the boats at police auctions to raise money that the cops are supposedly so short of these days. Things just don't add up. Statistics and media coverage is being manipulated. Are people further up the food chain taking backhanders from the people smuggling network to turn a blind eye. I wonder how long it would have taken UK to be overrun by Germans in WW2 if they had used rubber boats.
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Post by jackie on Aug 10, 2023 15:37:00 GMT 1
I have a long-unanswered question. Since it appears that the migrants aren't just being given a boat and told to head north, there being a driver who actually does the crossing, why don't the authorities arrest the driver, take him straight to court and destroy the boat so it can't be used for another trip. Alternatively sell the boats at police auctions to raise money that the cops are supposedly so short of these days. Things just don't add up. Statistics and media coverage is being manipulated. Are people further up the food chain taking backhanders from the people smuggling network to turn a blind eye. I wonder how long it would have taken UK to be overrun by Germans in WW2 if they had used rubber boats. Or better still provide safe routes so there is no need for people to risk their lives and line the pockets of the people smugglers.
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tim17
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Post by tim17 on Aug 10, 2023 15:52:32 GMT 1
I keep seeing the phrase being used but what would that mean in practical terms?
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exile
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Post by exile on Aug 10, 2023 16:30:06 GMT 1
Safe route: How about UK authorities in France, processing applications quickly* and putting successful candidates straight onto a train to London?
* Six months ago it was reported that a Syrian woman and her children had correctly applied for asylum in France and was granted it. She and her children however were still in Paris waiting for the official papers to allow entry to the UK - she was informed she had been successful in 2018!!! I don't know if @rses have moved since this was publicised. I do so hope so. It illustrated that the UK safe route was and probably still is a sham.
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Post by mangetout on Aug 10, 2023 16:36:16 GMT 1
I keep seeing the phrase being used but what would that mean in practical terms? It would mean being allowed to arrive in the UK via plane, ferry or train like anyone else and claiming asylum on arrival.
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exile
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Post by exile on Aug 10, 2023 18:27:59 GMT 1
I keep seeing the phrase being used but what would that mean in practical terms? It would mean being allowed to arrive in the UK via plane, ferry or train like anyone else and claiming asylum on arrival. I would like to think that was the way, but that door was closed years ago. Before you can get a boarding card you now have to disclose passport details and if not a UK passport holder or with passports from countries that have reciprocal rights (which excludes just about every departure country for genuine asylum seekers) you will also be required to provide details of your visa. Visas are generally only issued in the country of your passport, which is the last place an asylum seeker wants to return to. In fact if it is safe enough to return to your home country to request a visa, by definition, you cannot claim asylum. Catch 22 in the extreme.
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garbo
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Post by garbo on Aug 10, 2023 21:29:28 GMT 1
Sorry but most of these people are economic migrants NOT asylum seekers. Single males, where are the women and children??. They are trying to escape France ( a perfectly safe country I thought) WHY?? Why do they get in boats to escape when they are already in a safe place? The problems started with Blair with his open borders policy and then Merkel as we all know inviting millions to Germany but then expecting to disperse them to the whole of Europe. My god that woman did some damage. This will not change until the EU does more to stop the boats arriving in Italy and Greece. Europe/UK cannot absorb the whole of Africa etc deciding to move for “a better life”. E.g economic migrants.
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tim17
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Post by tim17 on Aug 10, 2023 21:29:59 GMT 1
The problem right now is the asylum application backlog, allowing tens of 0000's more to join the queue and being put on barges or in crappy hotels will just make the situation worse no matter how they arrive in the country.
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Post by jackie on Aug 10, 2023 21:56:19 GMT 1
Sorry but most of these people are economic migrants NOT asylum seekers. Single males, where are the women and children??. They are trying to escape France ( a perfectly safe country I thought) WHY?? Why do they get in boats to escape when they are already in a safe place? The problems started with Blair with his open borders policy and then Merkel as we all know inviting millions to Germany but then expecting to disperse them to the whole of Europe. My god that woman did some damage. This will not change until the EU does more to stop the boats arriving in Italy and Greece. Europe/UK cannot absorb the whole of Africa etc deciding to move for “a better life”. E.g economic migrants. Can you provide some facts from a credible source please that backs up your claim that most are economic migrants?
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cernunnos
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Post by cernunnos on Aug 11, 2023 8:13:03 GMT 1
It is very easy to find the information about asylum seekers , it is all on UK government sites online. About 70% of applicants are accepted , so that makes it a vaste majority ( a bit more than the Brexit vote ) If the UK had stayed in the EU , then they could have been returned to their point of entry , as we all know.
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exile
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Post by exile on Aug 11, 2023 10:55:16 GMT 1
Sorry but most of these people are economic migrants NOT asylum seekers. Single males, where are the women and children??. They are trying to escape France ( a perfectly safe country I thought) WHY?? Why do they get in boats to escape when they are already in a safe place? The problems started with Blair with his open borders policy and then Merkel as we all know inviting millions to Germany but then expecting to disperse them to the whole of Europe. My god that woman did some damage. This will not change until the EU does more to stop the boats arriving in Italy and Greece. Europe/UK cannot absorb the whole of Africa etc deciding to move for “a better life”. E.g economic migrants. As already pointed out the flaw in your argument is that over 70% are granted asylum, so if you are right, you should be barricading Whitehall for doing such a p155 poor job not regaling us with your nonsense. What was not mentioned is that that 70% acceptance is on first application. Failed applicants are normally given leave to appeal. Of those that do ( and I think we might imagine it would be most of them) the acceptance rate is also above 70%. So we are probably looking at 85-92% of all asylum seekers are accepted. I am sure I have told you this before but I will repeat it since you seem to have forgotten. The UNHCR who are responsible for how we treat refugees and asylum seekers, make it very clear that a person can apply for asylum wherever they want. The idea of first safe country is an EU construct. You remember the EU? That was the organisation that the UK chose to leave - as you all too often remind us. So isn't it just a tad hypocritical of you and the likes of Reece Mogg to keep reeling out an EU rule. WE left the EU. Get over it and accept that EU rules no longer apply. Edit to add: I was an economic migrant. When our business was taken over by a German company, I made moves to be relocated to the HQ in Germany - successfully. How many here I wonder also moved to France for a better life with cheaper (economic reason) property prices. Economic migrants also.
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garbo
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Post by garbo on Aug 11, 2023 12:54:53 GMT 1
When you moved to Germany and others to France I suspect you did it legally and didn’t throw your passports overboard on the ferry. I bet you didn’t claim to be a minor when in your thirties either. As you say you already had work to go to and if anyone were to apply to be resident in the EU they have to prove they have the wherewithal to support themselves be traceable and not be a drain on the state, the illegals are a drain on the state. I agree regarding the poor UK gov performance which lets up to 70% in. The figure would be much lower if the cases were assessed more thoroughly and quickly. The ECHR is one of the main issues here and the sooner it is amended or the UK leave the better.
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Post by ForumUser2 on Aug 11, 2023 12:57:22 GMT 1
The mistake most people seem to make is that they assume the anti-migrant stance is taken by people after careful thought and deliberation with full knowledge of the relevant laws and treaties governing the subject.
It's not. It's an atavistic response to the "other". It's a form of moral cowardice combined with self-interest and xenophobia. The brave new world of populist jingoism and fear of perceived (indeed, concocted) threat returns.
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Post by jackie on Aug 11, 2023 13:18:06 GMT 1
Its also government ministers who trot out the same old anti migrant tropes at every opportunity. I’m sick of pointing out that there’s no such thing as an ‘illegal’ No wonder the gullible and uninformed believe it.
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