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Post by iolar on Apr 21, 2024 10:36:23 GMT 1
I used to enjoy visiting my local main branch of Barclays as there was always a bunch of guys using Barclays Market Eye monitor with real time pricing. Moving to France I learnt very quickly that the ordinary French have zero interest in the markets and no wonder why, there is no interest because nothing in France encourages them to become financially literate.
I encouraged my wife to cash in her ISA she had had one share from the beginning - National Grid. At that time I didn't know that if you have held a share or investment for a long time then a reduction in tax of up to 65% is possible.
Plus if you are a foreigner who gains nothing from social charges then this charge is reduced to 7.05%. That is still a rip-off but better than paying 17.5%. I have no objection to paying a CGT tax. Having said that there are 7 countries in the EU which don't have CGT.
So I have to visit the Tax office before I make our online statement to check out if we have been overcharged. Also at the Tax office in Rodez we were told that we didn't have to declare any success with Premium Bonds.
The EU regs are a joke with countries like Luxembourg, Netherlnads and Ireland being tax havens for foreigners and foreign businesses, the whole thing is a bad economic joke.
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suein56
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Post by suein56 on Apr 21, 2024 11:19:33 GMT 1
Also at the Tax office in Rodez we were told that we didn't have to declare any success with Premium Bonds. This is true if, like the Lotto, you lose your stake each time you play but this is not so with Premium Bonds. You don't lose your Bonds unless you cash them in or you die. The income from them is regarded as just that - income, and should be declared.
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Post by elsie on Apr 21, 2024 11:23:52 GMT 1
I don't think you will be able to name seven EU countries which don't levy CGT - perhaps you mean Europe? And I think most of the seven have some time conditions, even if short taxfoundation.org/data/all/eu/capital-gains-tax-rates-in-europe-2022/The consensus over the years from French tax offices has been Premium Bond winnings are taxed as they are a share of the interest from the total deposits. Did you explain fully to the Rodez tax office unlike a lottery where you lose your stake if you don't win, with premium bonds you still retain your original investment and can take it at any time. If you can get a definitive written statement I'm sure many would be interested in a copy. Perhaps you should read this explanation and then revise your incorrect comments on social charges www.french-property.com/guides/france/finance-taxation/taxation/social-security/social-welfare-levy/
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Post by taffy on Apr 21, 2024 19:39:31 GMT 1
A quick Google search "premium bonds description" produces "a premium bond is a lottery bond issued by the UK government ...." - Wikipedia. Consensus from French tax offices doesn't make law!
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Post by elsie on Apr 21, 2024 21:15:57 GMT 1
A quick Google search "premium bonds description" produces "a premium bond is a lottery bond issued by the UK government ...." - Wikipedia. Consensus from French tax offices doesn't make law! Or you could try searching for "uk premium bond french taxation" and reading those hits
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Post by jardiniere on Apr 22, 2024 9:15:15 GMT 1
Just received my notification today. Déclarez en ligne vos revenus 2023. I'm going to try very very hard not to leave it until the last minute this year. Mine's quite simple and I have no excuse to delay. But I do.
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ajm
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Post by ajm on Apr 22, 2024 10:35:34 GMT 1
I used to enjoy visiting my local main branch of Barclays as there was always a bunch of guys using Barclays Market Eye monitor with real time pricing. Moving to France I learnt very quickly that the ordinary French have zero interest in the markets and no wonder why, there is no interest because nothing in France encourages them to become financially literate. I encouraged my wife to cash in her ISA she had had one share from the beginning - National Grid. At that time I didn't know that if you have held a share or investment for a long time then a reduction in tax of up to 65% is possible. Plus if you are a foreigner who gains nothing from social charges then this charge is reduced to 7.05%. That is still a rip-off but better than paying 17.5%. I have no objection to paying a CGT tax. Having said that there are 7 countries in the EU which don't have CGT. So I have to visit the Tax office before I make our online statement to check out if we have been overcharged. Also at the Tax office in Rodez we were told that we didn't have to declare any success with Premium Bonds. The EU regs are a joke with countries like Luxembourg, Netherlnads and Ireland being tax havens for foreigners and foreign businesses, the whole thing is a bad economic joke. I think the Rodez tax office is wrong. We have an accountant that has been doing our tax affairs for years and we always declare PB winnings - just like bank interest.
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Post by taffy on Apr 22, 2024 11:59:29 GMT 1
Unsurprisingly, I think that the Rodez office is correct! Just because the investment is returnable (albeit minus the cost of infalation) doesn't annul its staus/definition as a lottery. it's not a bet where the stake is lost unless it's won something. The likes of Spectrum?Blevins etc have theit own agenda; The Connexion is probably not the place I would personally look to for advice of this nature. À chacun son choix.
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Post by taffy on Apr 22, 2024 17:08:27 GMT 1
Addendum: The following is included under "Key features - Account Terms, About our Premium Bonds" published by NS&I; Premium Bonds don't pay interest. Instead they give you the chance to win cash prizes in a monthly draw. So it follows that a winner does not share interest!
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Post by omegal on Apr 22, 2024 17:27:12 GMT 1
All done and dusted using an accountant, emails back to inform me to look in Impots site, or from the accountants site
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ajm
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Post by ajm on Apr 22, 2024 17:54:07 GMT 1
Iolar and tafty. I stand by what I said about PB winninings being taxable. Hope you like prison food. The staff on the front desk are not necessarily up to date with international tax treaties and they are not the people who do your tax calculations.
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Post by elsie on Apr 22, 2024 18:47:02 GMT 1
As far as I am aware, NSI Premium Bonds have not registered to run a lottery in France so any winnings would not come under the French lottery taxation regulations. Unless specifically excluded by treaty, foreign-source income is taxable in France. There is no mention of lotteries in the UK-France Double Taxation Convention www.gov.uk/government/publications/france-tax-treatiesI've now sent a general question to my local tax office on behalf of all those holding Premium Bonds asking for a definitive ruling on how Premium Bond winnings should be declared, etc. I suspect they'll have to go up the chain to get that? All I've given is the NSI Premium Bond brochure www.nsandi.com/files/asset/pdf/premium-bonds-brochure.pdf so they'll have to do all the interpretation themselves (rather than me pointing them in any particular direction).
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Post by taffy on Apr 22, 2024 20:23:53 GMT 1
Thank you, Elsie, for taking the time to pursue this and obtain a response from your local tax office, although the local offices can be somewhat difficult on times - in the past my local inspector insisted on charging the full amount of social charges, despite the De Ruyter decision being handed down, which compelled me to take my case to the conciliator to obtain reimbursement (successfully obtaining relief amounting to over 3,000€). So, how much can we rely on the local office's view? In response to AJM, I did not obtain advice from "the front desk" so asume your comment is directed elsewhere. I have looked at the information at my disposal and formed the view which is already known & if I am on enquiry I am quite happy to justify my action. A question that you may not wish to answer is if you were liable for the full amount of social charges prior to the De Ruyter judgement did your accountant advise you that you were liable for the full amount (ie 17pc plus) social charges on any investment income (including Premium Bond winnings)? Maybe accountants can have a view which does not accord with the regulations - they are not the font of all knowledge for a variety of reasons - how many times do we read that dodgy tax avoidance schemes have been undone when scrutinised by the Revenue/courts?
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Post by tim17 on Apr 22, 2024 20:43:42 GMT 1
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ajm
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Tax forms
Apr 22, 2024 21:27:07 GMT 1
via mobile
Post by ajm on Apr 22, 2024 21:27:07 GMT 1
Mind you of you don't declare them you won't pay tax but you are cheating
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